Elevate As An Entrepreneur With Every Word You Say, with Deirdre Van Nest

Dan Sullivan: Hi, this is Dan Sullivan. I’d like to welcome you to the Multiplier Mindset Podcast.
 
Today’s Multiplier Mindset interview episode is Deirdre Van Nest. And Deirdre, as you can tell in about three seconds, comes from New York. First of all, she’s really funny. I was talking to Suvi Siu, our video manager for our videos, and I said, I’m just comprehending what it would be like to be seated next to Deirdre on a 15-hour plane trip. She’s such a compelling, wonderful person.
 
I want to start off my comments about what Deirdre had to say. First of all, it’s marvelous to hear what she says, both about coaching, period, but also her very kind comments about Strategic Coach. I deeply appreciate this, and we’re only going to get this out to about 10 million people. I’ve observed, because I’ve been a coach since 1974—so I just jumped into the deep end of the pool and kind of just survived for about 10 years.
 
And I had a feeling in the early 1970s that the world was changing. And my sense was that the main reason was this new thing called the microchip. So, it was just at that time, early 1970s, that the term microchip was being used, even though they had been developing it for the previous decade, maybe even longer. And I remember reading a New York Times set of articles by their science and technology editor. And he said, this is going to be the most remarkable invention of all the inventions, because it’s an invention that can be applied to all the existing inventions, and it’s an invention that can be applied to itself, so that the present level of chip can produce the higher level of chip.
 
And it seems to me that there’s a real context in terms of this switchover. And I’ve been coaching and I was kind of out there on my own when I first started coaching in 1974. And that is you had to explain in the entrepreneurial world what coaching was, because mostly we thought about it in terms of sports or the arts. You had theater coaches, you had dance coaches and everything else. So a lot of it wasn’t just explaining what you did, but “what’s coaching, anyway?”
 
That was a very useful challenge because I had to find very simple ways for people to kind of get it right away. But my sense 50 years later that, we’re in the 2020s right now, that the whole world I think is three tracks that are running upward together. One of the tracks, so the left-hand track, is technology, which develops exponentially. On the other side—I’ll talk about the one in the middle—but the other side is teamwork. So the promise of technology is that it’s going to improve teamwork. And it’s teamwork to start with that gives rise to technology. So you have teamwork that really works. It’s very predictable. And at a certain point, people say, you know, we can take this and make it automatic. You know, we can put it into a device. We can put it into a platform. we can put it into a network.
 
What’s missing from these two tracks is something in the middle, and that’s coaching. So, more and more, I’m saying what management was to the 20th century, which was industrial, big pyramids that required massive amounts of management, the management’s now in the technology. But in the middle, you need coaching, because technology doesn’t coach itself. It can’t pick up on what each individual is thinking about, can’t think about what the aspiration is. So coaching is in the middle.
 
And if you look at the growth of industries in the world, IT, information technology, is the fastest growing industry in the world. The second fastest growing industry in the world is coaching. Okay, so I have hundreds of coaches inside the strategic coach. And, you know, we have certain agreements about they create their tools; and our tools are our tools, your tools are your tools.
 
But I’m so blown away that she was going along and then, all of a sudden, she realized, you know, the big payoff is really not only that I’m great at what I do as an entrepreneur, but I can coach other entrepreneurs. And that in coaching other entrepreneurs, I become a better entrepreneur. By my having to dig deep, as Deirdre talks about, by my digging deep and just thinking what is it that I’m doing, that’s just incredibly useful to someone else. And then testing it out, I become better out of the process.
 
I mean, she introduced about 10 different subjects that you could go down forever. So she’s such a marvelous human being. And I’m so happy that her path and our path converged at a certain point, and I’m sure that we’re going to benefit enormously from Deirdre’s wisdom and her skill in the future.
 
Deidre Van Nest So my name is Deirdre Van Nest, and I’m a native New Yorker, lived in Minneapolis for 25 years. But now my husband and I live on a boat, which is a whole other interesting story, in St. Petersburg, Florida. So we made the official move last year to St. Petersburg, Florida. And I feel very blessed. I get to really live in my passion every single day.
 
You know, if I were to kind of give an umbrella over what I do, it’s I teach entrepreneurs and what I call subject matter experts, how to become high performance, high impact speakers, storytellers, and content creators, so they can not only increase their income, but also so they can increase their influence and their impact on the lives of others. I never thought I’d be doing what I’m doing.
 
If you had told me 20 years ago, “Deirdre, you’re going to be an international keynote speaker and corporate trainer, and then you’re going to teach other people how to knock it out of the park and bring in business through speaking,” I would have thought you were insane. Because in ninth grade I had a very bad experience in my acting class where I read a scene with a fellow student named Jennifer, and I thought I had delivered a Meryl Streep-worthy performance, only to look at my teacher and have him basically say like, “That stunk.”
 
And I was devastated and I was humiliated, and I left the stage for 24 years. Like I wish I could say that I grew a thicker skin or was like, okay, bad day, bad opinion, but I didn’t. I believed it, and it shut me down, and I left the stage for 24 years. No speaking, no acting, no nothing.
 
I mean, my fear was so bad that when I went to get my master’s degree—I have a master’s degree in occupational therapy. It was the end of our first year and three classmates came up to me and said, “Hey, Deirdre, do you want to run for president next year?” The only question I asked them was, “Do I have to give a speech?” And they looked at each other like very puzzled by that weird question. It was weird. And one of them eventually said like, “Well, probably at commencement.” And I said, “Nope, I’ll run for vice president.” That’s how much I avoided being in the public eye.
 
Fast forward to 2007, I get certified as a Fearless Living coach. That is a real thing. Sometimes people think I made that up, but it’s not. And I hung out my shingle in Minneapolis and I was working with entrepreneurs and business owners, helping them get past the fears and excuses that were holding them back in their business and their life.
 
And ironies of irony, this was one of my big ones, but I was not willing to face it yet. But every person I talked to when I said, “Hey, what’s the best way to grow a business?” they said, “Speaking, speaking, speaking, speaking. If you speak, you’re going to reach more people. If you speak, it’s one-to-many marketing. If you speak, you have a bigger impact. If you speak, you’ll be more visible.” And I said, no way, no way. And then they just wore me down.
 
And so in 2008, I thought, all right, you know what, I got to walk my talk. I’m going to do this thing. But if I do it, I’m going to be crazy good at this. So I hired a coach. I wrote the speech. I practiced more hours than you can even imagine. I got on every stage I could for free. I did the reps. And over time, some amazing things started happening.
 
So the first was I started bringing in coaching clients from the back of the room for my coaching practice. So my business development time became highly leveraged. I started getting paid to speak, which was shocking to me, like shocking to me. And then I was never humiliated. No one was in the back of the room throwing tomatoes at me, shouting, “You stink!” or heckling me. People were actually, like, their lives were being changed. People were like, things for the better were happening to them. And I thought, wow, this is really cool.
 
So what I started doing was I started teaching my mindset, coaching clients at the time who were also entrepreneurs, how they could do what I was doing. And it was very ad hoc. I would just teach them what I learned and hey, try this, try that. I realized the only thing I love more than knocking it out of the park myself when I speak is teaching other entrepreneurs how to do the same.
 
And the power of high impact, high performance speaking, you can use these skills to better your own life and the lives of others. And it’s a skill that lives inside of you. It’s not like investing in postcards or the next new fancy platform. Not that those are bad—like I have fancy platforms too—but this is a skill that lives inside of you and goes with you wherever you are, from business to business, from personal life, wherever you are. And so that was it.
 
So then in 2011, my speaking coach, Craig said, “Hey, I’m certifying coaches. Do you want to become one of my world-class speaking coaches?” And I was like, “Yeah!” So I made the shift from mindset coaching to speaking coaching. I’ve been doing that since 2011.
 
In 2012, I created my own system to meet the needs of entrepreneurs. I was trained by someone who’s focused in keynoting. I wanted to have a system that would be great for keynoters and those who want to get paid really well from speaking, but would also meet the needs of business owners who simply wanted to bring in leads from the back of the room. So the system I created, the Crazy Good Talks Blueprint, serves that purpose.
 
My clients are business owners like me who want to bring in business from the back of the room. They want to be highly visible. They want to be seen as thought leaders. And then a subset want to get paid, you know, high four and five figures. And so my system addresses the needs of all of that.
 
I’m also not a natural salesperson. I had several businesses prior to the business I have now that I would say I quote unquote failed out. I know Dan doesn’t really talk about failing, right? And I know we’re learning, right? But like, you know, if you’re looking at the world standards kind of failed out, and it felt like a massive failure, all because I could not sell my way out of a paper bag. Like I was terrified to ask any selling types of questions.
 
And I quickly realized with the selling and with the speaking that my why was greater than my fear. And so that’s where I would go. Like your why has to be greater than your fear. And so I would encourage you if you’re at a place where you’ve hit that rock bottom, you’re terrified, you’re scared, you don’t think you can do it, is to really dig in and explore that why, and make sure it’s bigger than your fear. And if it’s not, that’s another conversation you need to have with yourself, right? But we actually help entrepreneurs figure out their why and help them create their why story. So I’m very intimately, you know, have a relationship with this material, and it’s because it’s come out of my own use of it. But I recently did a storytelling workshop for a group of financial advisors on their why. And I got an email from one of them about a week after the workshop. And he was a little bit resistant.
 
And he said, “You know, I just want you to know that I was resistant and fearful of this, but tapping into my why has like reinvigorated my career. My wife died of cancer earlier this year and I have not been excited to get up and go to work. And tapping into my why has given me a joy again for what I do.” And I thought, yes! Oftentimes the person who needs to hear our why the most isn’t our client, our audience, our COIs—it’s us. So my why has been the thing that has gotten me over and past and through seemingly insurmountable obstacles.
 
So laying the groundwork, if you’re really wanting to use speaking as one of your main ways of getting your message out, your thought leadership out, you want to use it as a way to bring in business, maybe you also want to be paid to speak. There are a few things, there’s a lot that goes into it. Okay, I’m not going to sugar coat it. It is like training to be an elite athlete.
 
But there are some basic principles that I did not know when I started this journey that I would love to impart that will move you along faster in the journey. So the first thing is understanding that every time you speak, you audition for leadership. Every time, every time you open your mouth, whether you are talking for one minute, one hour, one day, whether you’re talking to one person, three people, 300, 3000, whether it’s in person or online, people are subconsciously making snap decisions on your competency based on your communication skills.
 
And think about this, you do this too, we do this all the time. I’m not going to get into anything controversial, but I feel like politics is a place we can all obviously see this playing out, right? Okay, so with that in mind, knowing that people are making snap decisions, knowing that people are literally saying to themselves, do I like this person? Do I trust them? Can they lead me? Do I want to work with them based on how you’re speaking?
 
It’s important that you treat every speaking opportunity as a high-stakes presentation. And so that’s one of the things that’s made me very successful as a speaker. And I’m not saying this to brag. I’m saying this because it’s something to consider. I’m in the top 1% of speakers globally and coaches. And it’s because I always have thought about every time I open my mouth, that’s a high stakes speaking opportunity. And so I treat everything that way. I treat it with the importance and the reverence. I’ll sometimes have clients or entrepreneurs come to me and they’re like, “Yeah, it’s only 20 people and it’s just 30 minutes and it’s not a big deal.” And I’m like, “No, no, no, no, my friend. That is a huge deal.” And let me give you a couple of perspectives.
 
One, what you have to understand is the privilege that you’ve been given. Listen, people are busy. People have so much going on in their life. And if another human being is willing to give you their time and attention, their heart, mind, and soul for any amount of time, you owe it to them to be good. You owe it to them to be prepared and to make their life better. That is time they will never, never get back. So that’s number one.
 
But number two, every time you speak, it’s an opportunity. You don’t know who’s in the audience. So here’s a perfect example. Years ago, I was asked to deliver a workshop at a conference. And at that point, I was starting to get paid, but I also was doing a lot of no-fee speaking if it was the right opportunity. And so this was a no-fee event and there was supposed to be about 100 people in the audience. Okay, so my ideal audience—100 people, this is great. I’m going to bring in clients to the back of the room.
 
So I get to the event and there’s 20 people. So that could be very disappointing, but I didn’t let it be disappointing because I trusted God had the right people in the room. And so that’s what you have to always trust. It’s not about the quantity, it’s the quality. So I delivered that presentation like it was a high stakes keynote, treated those people the same way I would treat if I was on a massive stage. And in the audience was a leader named Mark. Mark comes up to me afterwards and he says, “Deirdre, that was incredible. I want to introduce you to Betsy. Betsy’s running this event. I think you’d be a great speaker for this event.”
 
Mark introduces me to Betsy. I do a speaking engagement for Betsy. That was back in 2014. It is now 2024. I still work with this Fortune 300 company. I have probably earned, I’d have to do the numbers, but I’d say at least a million dollars in revenue from my work with them. I have been all across the organization and it started with a free presentation workshop that most people would blow off to 20 people. So be in the mindset that every time you open your mouth, you’re auditioning for leadership, and it’s a high stakes presentation and you want to prep to that degree. So that’s number one.
 
And then number two is most people think speaking, like when you think of a great speaker, what do you think? And a lot of times when I ask that question, people will be like pacing, you know, pauses, charismatic, energetic, good stories, that type of thing, okay? What they’re pointing to is delivery. What most people don’t understand is delivery is only about 20% of what goes into being a great speaker. The other 80% is a combination of content and structure.
 
Here’s an analogy. Have you ever seen a great actor in a pretty cruddy movie? Yes, you’ve definitely seen a great actor in a cruddy movie. Will that actor win an Academy Award for that movie? Absolutely not. So I think of the actor Will Smith, who I think is so talented and gifted, who has won Oscars. He was in a movie called After Earth. Have you heard of the movie After Earth? Probably not, because it was not a good movie, right? Is it that Will Smith is a bad actor? No, we know he’s an amazing actor, but he can’t rise above the level of the screenplay. You can never rise above the level of your screenplay.
 
And what this means is to be a high impact, high performance, crazy good speaker, you have to be an incredible content creator. You have to know how to structure your content and weave in anchors, and stories, and questions, and analogies, and experiences so that you appeal to the emotional centers of the brain. Your content has to be able to capture people’s attention, keep their attention, and inspire them to take action. And that’s probably one of the biggest secrets that people don’t understand. And once they understood, like once I learned that from my coach, once I understood that great speaking is, you know, two parts being a great content creator and one part delivery, it unlocked so many doors for me. And that’s what’s enabled me to take what I do and replicate it and teach other people. People who you would never believe could be great speakers. Like you give me anybody who is willing to do the work. I don’t care how boring you think they are, how monotone they think they are, how shy they are, how quiet they are. If they’re willing to learn the skills to be a great content creator and write great content and great speeches, they can absolutely hit a home run when they speak.
 
And that is exciting because great speakers are not born that way. They are made and it levels the playing field for everybody. But again, I don’t want to sound self-serving, so it doesn’t matter if it’s me or somebody else. Like, you need a coach. This isn’t something that people are just– You do. I mean, you just do. If you want to be excellent at this, and even if you want to be really good, right, and you want to get results, absolutely, you need a coach. And you need someone to guide you and you need someone to shorten the learning curve for you. This is not something you’re going to learn by just pressing your nose against the glass. And why would you want to? Like get a guy, get someone who’s been there before you to actually show you the way.
 
And then—and this is the part, like, I don’t like this part of what I do at all—but you’ve got to practice and prep. I actually really dislike the prep and the practice. Unfortunately, I have to prep it and practice more than I ever get to be on stage. And it’s just true. It is like an elite athlete. They are training more than they’re having those moments in the sun. And just understanding that that’s part of the game will help elevate you beyond where most people will ever reach as a communicator. So I joined Strategic Coach in 2018, and it has been one of the best decisions I’ve made for myself and for my business. My motivation for joining Strategic Coach was that I had hit that proverbial Ceiling of Complexity. I knew that I wanted a self-managing business, like desperately. I wanted that so badly I could just taste it and feel it with everything of my being, and I had zero clue how to get there. I had heard about Coach for several years. One of my mentors actually was also a member of Strategic Coach, and so she would say things here and there. I started hearing it from other people.
 
And so it was actually a couple of years, quite frankly, where it was on my radar, and I just wasn’t ready to join yet. I don’t really remember exactly why. I just know that I wasn’t ready to join until I was ready to join, if that makes sense. And a lot of what I’ve done, I’m ready to do it like I know, like, okay, now’s the time. And that was it, because I don’t do things unless I’m ready to jump in with all feet and everything I have, right?
 
So I jumped in and it’s been great. What I have learned along the way– I posted recently when I renewed, right, when I renewed for this next year, that Strategic Coach has taught me how to think differently. And when you think differently, you become different. And when you become different, you do different. So that has been my journey, is this journey of thinking differently and then being willing to become a different type of entrepreneur. And then because of that, put different things in place that I never thought I could do or just never even knew to do.
 
And I can say with like great joy that sitting here today, I have a Self-Managing Company. You know, I’ve taken a sabbatical for a month, and nobody reached out to me. That was amazing. You know, like I can go away on vacation. I can have Free Days. I know if I want to take time off or need to take time off, this company can run without me.
 
As entrepreneurs, we have to be good stewards of our resources. And we are constantly making decisions of where to invest, where to pull back. And there are a lot of opportunities that come our way to do a lot of different amazing things, right? A lot of different amazing programs and coaches and skill building. And it could be easy to look at Coach and say, “Oh, you know what? I don’t have the money for that,” or “Let me do it in a few years when I have more money.” I’m not saying those concerns aren’t real. I’m not in your budget. I don’t know.
 
But here’s what I will say is there is a massive opportunity cost to not doing this. I feel the same with Coach, right? Yes, you’re going to see an ROI in terms of what you’re going to gain, but I think the bigger play, and maybe even initially, is you are allowing a lot of opportunity, and not just opportunity for revenue, but opportunity for peace, opportunity for fun, opportunity for joy to walk out the door the longer you put off this decision.
 
Strategic Coach loves you. Like once you’re in, you’re part of this community. I really feel like it’s like there’s no entrepreneur left behind. There was a time where I needed some flexibility in my schedule and they’re like, of course you can do your workshop the next quarter. Of course you can talk to the Program Advisor. There’s people to talk to. There’s people who are reaching out to you.
 
You go above and beyond what you promise. You definitely way over-deliver on your promise. And I truly feel that every single member of the team is totally invested in my success and really cares about me. That’s virtually and behind the scenes backstage, the team couldn’t be better. And when we show up for those workshops, it’s like the red carpet is rolled out. We are treated like a VIP down to the snack at 3 p.m.
 
And I cannot tell you how far that goes in a world that’s very automated. You have kept this business so personal and relationship oriented that that is one of the other things that just keeps me coming back. And I really appreciate it.